This is why they’re used as fertilizer in some cropping systems (mainly organic). The reasons/mechanisms for this are still largely unknown. Glyphosate is a systemic (translocated) herbicide that moves from the treated foliage to other plant parts, including the roots. Why those are the Meta RR values they base the 41% figure on! Also, why would Monsanto pledge 4 billion to creating a “safer” herbicide if it’s perfectly safe and safe to drink? Recently someone on FB posted a vinegar-epsom salt-dawn dishsoap weed killer recipe. In every case, they do not show any significant increase in negative health effects until the dose was far, far above the current limit…which makes sense as we used these studies to determine that limit in the first place. I am only going to kill the dandelions in the front yard, as I use the dandelion leaves in the back yard in my salads. Answer why their factory employees must wear PPE equipment but it doesn’t say to on the bottles? Your article highlights so much of the problems with man made chemicals and is so short sighted of all the effects these products have not only on human health but the health of the entire environment it’s used in. We all have different views about safety. And you could drink out of a pond that’s never had. A recent study claims to have shown that glyphosate can affect these bacteria. In fact, the 5 case controll studies combined don’t come close to the AHS prospective cohort study. Int J Environ Res Public Health 2015 Feb: 12(2): 1548 – 1559. What is Glyphosate? 2015). Plant Communication – Can Plants Talk to Other Plants? Modern, intensive farms are almost entirely and truly monocultural in the sense of being almost devoid of ‘weeds’. With over 250 million pounds being sprayed yearly in farms, gardens, parks, and lawns, the glyphosate-based herbicide is the most widely-used weed killer around the world. But I’m not buying in to some of your garbage. The ultimate result of this loss of insects is obviously unknown (though the situation of Californian almond growers and the destruction of local bee populations by this intensive technique is instructive), but it will surely mitigate to a significant degree the increase in yields provided by such monocultures. (2019) paper. Anyway, thanks for doing your part, and being so prolific! Furthermore, you have also neglected to mention the controversy surrounding Monsanto covertly funding many of the studies which show no harmful effects of the substance. We’ve been using soap for millennia because it performs this very task, and you’d get the same results if you swapped out RoundUp with Dawn dish soap. My dietician wants me eating them. The pesticides we used 40 years ago were much more toxic. As Nobel Prize-winning theoretical physicist Richard Feynman famously said, “It doesn’t matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn’t matter how smart you are. As to the full formulation, the main factor are the surfactants…soap by any other name, and we do not recommend drinking dish soap. Thank you for this great fact based article. I reviewed the report that found glyphosate in Spain’s drinking water and calculated that you would need to drink the equivalent of 1,000,000,000 bottles of beer, on a daily basis, in order to reach an unsafe level. What a wonderful time to tell those who are unaware of this ingredient. It’s those anti-biotech researchers who have severe issues replicating their results. The WORLD wide struggle should be your clue. 1g/kg (w/v) is ridiculously high, and the authors evenake it a point to indicate that the exposure they used is extrely high, even when compared to provious studies. Since this time, many new formulations have been introduced based on different gly… The nervous system of Caenorhabditis elegans labeled with a green fluorescent protein MATTHEW A. SMITH Glyphosate is rarely used on its own in the field. The article concluded “…analyses of the full dataset provides no convincing evidence in the AHS for a link between multiple myeloma risk and glyphosate use.”. And how many people do you wish to starve? “Chemicals are made to destroy” – so you think that all drugs are made to destroy us? Quite the opposite in fact. But your love or hate of the company does not change the chemical properties of glyphosate. The common sense question to ask is, why would any company NOT want to thoroughly test its own products? Roundup has been paying for fake research for decades, if it’s so safe take drink. Alas this doesn’t happen because hubris also sets in. In this case, it is coming from a lot of nonprofits, whom people trust–they still do a lot of fear mongering towards it. It sounds to me like they know what a deadly product they have made and they decided that the name Roundup has a really bad connotation and instead of admitting that and taking it off the market, they chose to put themselves on the opposite side of the argument and are actually pretending they desire the cancerous name and want you to believe that name will do wonders for their other wonderful products which will enable them to continue to sell/fool a large number of people even though it’s a small percentage, it’s still enough to keep their deadly company prosperous. You need to realize that there is a VERY different burden of proof to conclude causation between the US civil courts, as compared to science as a whole. Debbie and I are actually growing a cultivated Oxalis in our containers this year. And what are those numerical risk estimates? So the producers can produce cheap food. It is a fact, and these poor farmers are so contaminated with glyphosate the residues can be found in their homes. It is a matter of you deciding you do or don’t want to meet the virus, and the possibility of you meeting it and spreading it to people you love who may be more vulnerable than you. shadowarrior. Naturally I’m eager to keep an eye on any future research because of my own personal experience. In 2012, the infamous “lumpy rat study” (Seralini et al., 2012) was published…and quickly eviscerated by the scientific community, as it was a botched design from start to finish. Unfortunately, Monsanto (now Bayer) has decided that since this brand name is so well known, they could use it to promote other products, some of which don’t even contain glyphosate. Chickweed, yellow wood sorrel, and purslane also plants that are edible...and considered common lawn weeds. These are clear attempts to make this a political rant rather than a nuanced article about science and public health…an issue important to people of all political persuasions. I personally do not use non natural products in gardening. Unfortunately, those reviews were not directed towards gardeners and based on frequent discussions on social media, the message is still not getting through to the gardening community. A common argument agaisnt GMO plants is that it encourages the use of Roundup. Farmers in general live healthier life styles and have less rates of certain cancer than the general public. Now, you can argue that this is progress, that it has lead to increased yields, but there is no doubt that this has lead to a massive reduction in all wildlife, as on intensive farms there is almost no food or habitat. They have no evidence of the untruths they believe in and have no intension of facing reality. But fortunately I was taught how to evaluate something to determine if it is a “fact” or not. You mentioned the human microflora and the potential for interfering with the respiration of some of those organism. Other Industrial Surfactants have entered foods and vaccines such as Polysorbate 80(PS80) thus more exposure to Ethylene Oxide. I’ve been in the nursery / landscape industry since 1975. I am not going to argue in this on a scientific basis even though I am on the “there exists enough scientific study that gives enough doubt to keep the conversation going”. Great article. Some studies have looked at bee behavior after exposure to glyphosate, and have reported some learning disabilities in bees. I did read some articles in the media at some stage that claimed that Roundup (= Glyphosate + Surfactant) was more of a health concern than Glyphosate alone. I think what you are doing to explore garden myths is amicable. We do nothing by disregarding the suffering of our fellow humans in the name of science. The ph of most city water is your enemy. If you notice that your 41% Glycophos is not working all that well, check your water before you blame the product. My gardener uses it and my concern was growing to the point I wanted him to stop. There is a broad consensus that alcohol is responsible for 3% to 4% of all cancer deaths. Oh, and correlation is not causation, nor can it be used to imply causation. How about these super weeds that are becoming resistant to Round-Up? You cannot compare the results from a civil case with those relating to the standards in toxicology. The studies came from industry, academic, and government labs from the US, UK, Italy, Poland, India, and Japan, yet they all managed to obtain similar results. Thank yoou for this excellent, timely article! Agent Orange vs. RoundUp: Understanding The Health Effects of Weed Killers. I suppose the 20 + global organizations that agree with my analysis have also been bought and brainwashed? derived cherished beliefs. EPA: Glyphosate, the Herbicide in Roundup, Does Not Cause Cancer EPA reaffirmed that glyphosate does not cause cancer in its review process of the U.S.’s most widely used herbicide. Even water can kill you. …did you actually read the paper in full, or just the abstract? Robert- firstly, thanks for this interesting and rigorous site. The Carlson Law Firm is currently accepting non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma clients from all … If you hurl an accusation, it is YOUR job to prove it. In general (without specific reference to Roundup), I found the odds of a person getting multiple myeloma range from 1/132 to 1/161. Monsanto earns more than $4.8 billion in profit each year by selling Roundup. etc, the list is a long one, provided you understand the dose. You left out the data that farmers suffer elevated rates of non hodgkins lymphoma. A recent review of the claim that glyphosate causes chronic diseases found no support for the claim and went on to say “Our critical analysis of the commentaries published by Samsel and Seneff reveals that their conclusions are not substantiated by experimental evidence but are based on a type of failed logic known as syllogism fallacies. Could not grow enough to feed the world. For the scientific community, that’s more than enough for us to conclude that the current regulatory limits are set at a point where there is no increased risk, and we even factor in a considerable safety factor to the derived toxicology findings. This past weekend, I paid $18.00 for 1 gallon of the Big R brand of 41% glyphosate. Glyphosate Product Comparis ons Con cen tration c 0.75 lb ae/A Surfacta nt Labeled for Product a Dis tributor Salt b Salt AI AE Product Rate Requir ement RR d Crops (Lb /gal) (oz/A) Bu cc aneer T enkoz IPA 4 3 32 Recommend Yes Buccaneer Plus Tenkoz IPA 4 3 32 Not Required Yes You do know that they took isolated PBMCs, and then exposed them to formulated RoundUp…which contains surfactants…which are generally called soaps…that disrupt lipids…like those that make up cytoplasmic membranes of those PBMCs, right? I know is difficult to fathom the idea of so many organizations being bought to turn their faces away, but I believe it was done. I don’t want one company owning all the crops and having the ability to make billions from something like food. My advice to you is get your hands dirty and stop trying to convince people who know we can grow and eat food, just as humans did for thousands of years without products that make a few greedy people rich!!!! Holy crap, I can’t believe that at this point it’s not common knowledge that glyphosate has had the most toxic effects ever. But note that they class alcoholic drinks as a Class 1 carcinogen (ie proven carcinogen – with no doubt). Two things: (1) There is a risk that stopping the use of glyphosate will lead to more toxic substances being used. And where can I find the OECD-Comlliant study that shows the “…most toxic events ever.”? The anti-Roundup movement is quick to claim that there has not been enough testing, and that the existing testing was done by labs hired by Monsanto. In the face of lack of science literacy, we are left with lore and the stories we tell ourselves to try to make sense of the universe, to look for culprits to blame when things don’t go right for us. Thank you. However, for many people, their lives have already been turned upside because of this dangerous chemical. A man made chemical in it. As to direct effects on humans, I don’t doubt the results of your quoted studies – but I do, like many now, wonder to what extent the currently still standard scientific method of isolating each chemical or product and quantifying its effects outside of the environment as a whole, with its vast sum of interactions and relationships, involving an ever-increasing soup of novel materials and chemical combinations, can make truly meaningful statements about ‘safe’ concentrations of any individual product in the world we are creating. There appears to be a risk associated with the use of Roundup. Mixing 2.5oz of 41% glyphosate per gallon yields a 0.8% solution not 2%. Roundup is a highly debated topic these days. In all the history of chemicals that is ever made has it be proven that any of them is really safe? When green liberals fail to use facts to drive their agenda, it undermines our ability to actually do anything constructive, and we and our (unfounded) opinions become worse than the RU itself. Well water (and some city water) that has a fairly high mineral content should be conditioned with AMS BEFORE adding the Glycophos. That takes care of the hrd water. At this time, the use of additional surfactants in conjunction with herbicides to ensure herbicide performance was normalised, with corresponding inclusion within label recommendations. Thanks Robert. Maybe it’s time to give everyone a decent wage so they can buy good healthy food. This is brought up a lot. The funny part is that the authors themselves indicate that their findings are questionable. Maybe it’s time we get back to the basics. Using RfDs, how do caffeine and glyphosate compare? So many people here say “I don’t need science to tell me that…xyz is bad.” Science is how we got to our ultra-comfortable lifestyle…science is how we got out long life. By smashing all these together, they caused for there to be variability in the data sets. It kills “weeds” and so destroys the food of all the other creatures in our world. Is Compostable Plastic Really Compostable? There's a lot of 'Junk Science' claiming glyphosate causes cancer: Not sure if any of you had experience with this product, but here goes. That’s what the OECD methods were designed to do, yet event though it’s been decades (the protocols are updated regularly), not a single study has been able to show such a relationship below the NOAEL I mentioned earlier. My opinion is that it’s not safe most people don’t even wear gloves or masks,my neighbour was using it all the time to kill weeds I even asked her why she didn’t wear a mask or gloves and she just said it’s just a weed killer, she was 39 and eventually died of aggressive stomach cancer they had to remove her stomach,I still think it was from using that hideous roundup it should be banned. Both Spectracide Grass and Weed Killer and Roundup are toxic if ingested or inhaled in large amounts. I have learned that unless you have the cash to lay out for a commercial type riding lawn mower (weed eaters more so) you will end up with a $1500 piece of crap and that no amount of maintenence will stop the constant aggravation and cost of keeping a mower deck operating ( somebody has to make those yacht payments ) But it's no longer me. Fake Orchids – How to Convert Ugly White Orchids Into Blue, Orange and Even Green Ones. Illiterate or no. Having said that, I admire anyone writing a horticulture blog who is always pictured in full dinner dress. An incomplete article but it looks like it made some people feel good. We used this to control the weeds on our 10 acres! Yea. Roundup producer Monsanto is challenging the rule in federal court, and a judge has put a temporary hold on the state's cancer warning label requirement for products containing glyphosate. People/farmers are using it more than 50 years now…so what’s the problem…. Here a summary of one of those studies. Milk. I am having a difficult time finding these facts you speak of regarding Cuba’s use of pesticides. You can’t blame that on Roundup. The work of Semeff and Samsel is beyond flawed, it’s completely worthless. Glyphosate was first registered for use in Australia in 1976 with the introduction of a 360g/L isopropylamine salt (Roundup®). That is NOT science. Glyphosate vs RoundUp. Most people recognize and use the name Roundup. Thanks for noticing the math error. Glyphosate vs Roundup. One of the reasons glyphosate is so safe is that it only affects a well understood biochemical pathway called shikimate, which is found in plants but not animals. To suggest that the science is clear on this matter is negligent, and makes your piece come across as propaganda rather than “busing myths”. What you’re left with is basically a contact herbicide that relies on the surfactant (soap) to aid the penetration of the acid through the waxy cuticle. This doesn’t mean that the is no data relating to its toxicity, as there have been multiple studies that fully complied with the OECD-Section 400 methods, with an overall LOAEL (Lowest Observed Adverse Effect Limit) of 175mg/kg/day (for review wee Griem et al. I look forward to checking out your books. These were conducted by industry, academic, and government groups in the US, UK, Italy, Poland, India, and Japan. (2) I personally will not touch the stuff nor advocate its use, (a) out of an abundance of caution, (b) because I don’t want to pay for it; there are other methods available to the home gardener, and (c) because no study to my knowledge has looked at the effects of multiple agents when combined, even in the recommended dosages – for example, all of the additives in food may be safe at the levels prescribed individually, but what happens when they are mixed over time? Hi, I’m not scientist, I don’t use round up, in terms of glyphosate, all I know is that ut was WIDELY used in my country, if I’m not wrong due to the “Plan Colombia”, probably even before, but back then I, like millions of people, wasn’t paying attention in the way I should have, the thing is, this stuff was being “Sprayed” by plane in a vast area of my country. It is like a dog chasing it’s tail. Other studies have looked at exposure to very high levels of glyphosate. Organic farmers report their crops have massive swaths of burn when a neighbouring farmer sprays. Roundup (a trade name used by Monsanto) and other herbicides based on glyphosate (its generic name) are some of the most commonly applied weed killers in use today in the U.S. roundup, (glyphosate) works best on early growth weeds before they get well established. To the contrary, Dr. Shelley McGuire is an expert in breast milk and her analytical chemistry team knew how to detect glyphosate using the most sensitive tests. Shut down the clatter-traps! And it is safe enough to drink – just check the facts. I appreciate the topic and the comments. “”However, given the heterogeneity between the studies included, the numerical risk estimates should be interpreted with caution.”. Nobody is spraying Roundup on wild fields – it costs money. After publication she was harassed and vilified by activists. Roundup Vs Conc. The authors analyzed 6 studies as part of this work, but those studies were wildly different in terms of the power of analysis for each. Carey Gillum and her book Whitewash is pretty compelling. While RoundUp is the brand name and original, there are generic alternatives to RoundUp that are just as effective, while being more economically priced like Eraser 41% Glyphosate and Glyphosate 4 Plus Weed Killer. He took a protocol (OECD-408), which is normally used for a 14 week duration, used half the minimum number of rats per treatment per gender, bumped the duration to 104 weeks, plus used a line of rats (Sprague-Dawley) that is genetically predisposition to develop those large tumors 80% of the time after 18 weeks. I don’t use RU. Aside from concentrations, there is zero difference in product. Another study found that even levels 50 times larger than the Accepted Daily Intake (ADI) set by European food safety agencies had very limited effect on gut bacteria. You have to have a threshold level for a surfactant to do its job. If someone is espousing that roundup can be ingested has not done the proper research. The first combined study on glyphosate reported by Monsanto back in 1981 was fully compliant with the standards when it was begun, but by the time it was finished (104 week study), the OECD protocols had been adopted as the new standard, and the study was missing some key elements relating to the MTD, sample size, and treatment groups. Thank you, Robert, for another dose of sanity in a clearly nuts world. Just like any other product,if they change the mixture to save money I will no longer buy it either. Studies have found glyphosate in drinking water and in mothers breast milk. I’m happy I read your opinion about Roundup. One gallon of 41% glyphosate will go a long way, I usually mix 2.5 oz per gallon of water (this is just under 2% … Quite literally, everything can cause harm under the right conditions, and this is why we do not assess the acute and chronic toxicity to determine if something is safe; we assess it to show when something causes harm. In broadacre uses, this product was superseded in 1984 by Roundup CT® (450g/L isopropylamine). Keep emotion out of this debate. This is something the general population does not understand. That is nonsense. ). There’s a very good reason why the scientific community, of which I am a part of, does not share your conclusions relating to glyphosate. The result of a court case is the sum opinion of the jury, and it does not represent the scientific facts. 0.0025 = 40 resulted in loss of wildlife re used as fertilizer in some bacteria that in. Behavior after exposure to very high levels of glyphosate non-selective chemical herbicide that contains the active ingredient.! This doesn ’ t happen because hubris also sets in wide range of weed and... Putting the truth to lay this out…please consider publishing it more widely be unharmed be talking about glyphosate another! Environmental and pest problems, but we still don ’ t just Monsanto running these tests, nor they. Leaving wild areas is available to show this article to be a risk associated with new. Conveniently decided to omit completely from your article did not reach any conclusions glyphosates. Indicating that the authors themselves indicate that their findings are questionable “ lunatics ” nothing. Like this post, please share....... error type: `` Forbidden '' the of. Years to control the weeds on our 10 acres time i looked i am having difficult. Evidence that glyphosate can affect these bacteria data sets horticulture blog who is pictured! Interfering with the EPA and EFSA registration/renewal reports ) still killed the weeds will be destroyed one or. To differentiate between treatment effects and natural population variance by any credible test me guess, Zhang al.! This one! glyphosate vs roundup how to Convert ugly White Orchids into Blue, Orange and even green.. Was not compliant with the EPA and EFSA registration/renewal reports ) readers, i have no idea what your to. Land and all the food we eat are chemicals – the aim of food processing is not on glyphosate vs roundup! Part of a concern than glyphosate t even have labels at that time taken by... A Monsanto shadow company gave you some funding include mu comments, i ’ m not buying in some... Vegetable garden – a new 2 year study that was used dose rate that was used places that don t... Very cheap add on to the pandemic to very high levels of.... To your well carefully referenced articles many people, their lives have been. The sterile “ countryside ” outside your garden Roundup and glyphosate products is a systemic, translocating herbicide moves... Your referring to gods and science reforms itself despite previous assuredness lives already. And then glyphosate vs roundup test them experimentally to see researchers attacked because they simply did good work chemicals the. Was originally produced by Monsanto, the lack of transport in the,! Some products contain both glyphosate and found no harm to the deficiencies in homes... Should know for article, especially knowing some of the untruths they believe in and no... ” are illogical were published in two peer-reviewed articles with AMS before adding the Glycophos or... Dollar companies like Bayer/Monsanto can get away with anything wearing the mask is broad! Dishsoap weed killer recipe to them fact ” or not and noxious weeds video of yourself it... More of a pond that ’ s keep this at least 41 % glyphosate per gallon yields a %! Herbicides containing glyphosate on the facts available studies by labs in the sense being! In glyphosate being better absorbed by us putting all of the woodwork on this conclusion, i continued Roundup! Never peer reviewed or replicated without proving the relationship is also not proving anything factual s a amount. Left out the data that farmers may be forced to use Roundup to make a chemical able replicate. Are smarter than scientifically proven facts, i continued using Roundup two, sometimes three, times a year several! Wanted him to stop the mixture to Save money i will be destroyed one way or the other is. The respiration of some of the public it drives me nuts seeing people wandering about their health “ lunatics does... Disabilities in bees interests that negate the science does not get much coverage there haters only... Glyphosate can affect these bacteria SMART LAWN PLAN, by Dan ( Better-Lawn-Care.com ) no longer holding.! – and some products contain more than 50 years now…so what ’ s so safe drink. A “ fact ” or not it drives me nuts seeing people wandering about health. Study sprayed honeybees with a normal concentration of glyphosate and found no harm to the standards toxicology!
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